What makes for a good soundstage?

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walterwhite
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Re: What makes for a good soundstage?

Unread post by walterwhite »

Daniel Quinn wrote:For me the three biggest improvements in soundstage ie - width , height , debth and discernible space between instruments and multiple voices are in reverse order

1. turntable support
2. cartridge
3. Simplified crossove
I love vinyl, but but the disks I own are largely survivors of a misspent youth, and, as such don't really warrant a huge investment in a turntable. I'm happy with a fairly humble Project deck with an Ortofon Super OM30 MM cartridge and stylus. I have spent out on some new 180 gram pressings which, I have to say are lovely, but I think digital is the system I'm looking at improving on at the moment.

I listen to roughly 50/50 classical and other genres, and I personally find I enjoy the classical stuff on digital sources more. Pops and crackles are a lot more easy to ignore on recordings with a bit more going on.

Simplified crossovers come under the remit of speakers, which is the area I'm looking to improve at the moment. Some equipment reviews coming soon.

Some of the Docs' amps arriving imminently, and a pair of early 80's Monitor Audios later in the week, which will replace the Spendors regardless. I'll then sell them on and use the funds to finance the speaker quest.
Bi-amped A80's, P90sa, LS6, AP10h, Phono2/2 PSU's, BMU, SSC, SSP2, Raspberry pi/Durio Sound Dacs, Rega RP6/Dynavector 10x5, Royd RR2.

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guydarryl
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Re: What makes for a good soundstage?

Unread post by guydarryl »

Hi,

Rega Ela come up slightly more often than Royd - early mk1 (full fluting on front baffle) were developed by Royd and Rega as joint venture? They use Royd drivers I think and have a very simple crossover. I love mine (owned from "new", ex demo' pair).

Guy
LP12, Ittok, DV10X5, Phono2(twin supply), P50SA , Art Audio Quintet, LS5, SSC, Rega Ela mk1
Sony cdp xb930, Alessandro ms1

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walterwhite
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Re: What makes for a good soundstage?

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guy wrote:Hi,

Rega Ela come up slightly more often than Royd - early mk1 (full fluting on front baffle) were developed by Royd and Rega as joint venture? They use Royd drivers I think and have a very simple crossover. I love mine (owned from "new", ex demo' pair).

Guy
Rega added to list = thanks for the input.
Bi-amped A80's, P90sa, LS6, AP10h, Phono2/2 PSU's, BMU, SSC, SSP2, Raspberry pi/Durio Sound Dacs, Rega RP6/Dynavector 10x5, Royd RR2.

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walterwhite
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Re: What makes for a good soundstage?

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Just an update for anyone who's interested.

The Doc's amps (pair of A80's + pre-amp with clicky knobs) are waking up nicely now, after about six weeks or so, and I did get the pair of Monitor Audio 1200 Gold Reference speakers of Ebay for £65 - silly money really.

The speakers out perform the Spendors quite nicely, though fettling was a real pain. They have a cavity in the plinth that needs to be tuned to the environment by filling with sand. Too little and they bloom like a field of lavender on a summers afternoon, too much and the bass all but disappears completely. It's a really fiddly job, and I finally settled on a method of filling small bags with sand and adding or subtracting as necessary. Once the correct amount of bass was achieved there was still a problem with "chuffing" from the rear ports, which was sorted by placing some sound absorbing material loosely behind them. Toeing them in proved to be critical too. Most speakers I have owned seemed to prefer a fairly sharp toe in angle, either pointing towards the ears or even, in some cases, more at my nose. These however are pointed at the wall behind me, angled in only a very few degrees. Took me a couple of weeks before I stumbled on this, but the difference was quite remarkable for such a simple adjustment.

The final result is a pair of speakers that deliver a far superior sound stage to the Spendors, and are sonically very acceptable indeed. Led Zepps' "Whole Lotta Love" really rocks, and the sound effects in the psychedelic central section rotate around your head and literally come from directly behind you. Not strictly about the music I know, but great fun, and a very graphic illustration of the ability of a speakers ability to project sound from outside the box. Same goes for the guitar in Stings' "All This Time" from his "The Soul Cages" CD. No longer am I assailed by the two dimensional effect of the Spendors - what a relief! I had truly wondered whether I'd just been imagining all of theses things, or even whether my ears had just had it.

Classical music too is nice, especially smaller scale pieces such as the Beethoven string quartets that I'm listening to a lot at the moment. Nice separation between the instruments, and a sweet tonal balance with realistic sounding instruments. Large scale orchestral works, however, are harder work, with denser passages starting to show signs of the speakers struggling to keep pace. Truth is, I've yet to discover the speaker that can do this really well, so I'm not too disappointed by this. That'll be the next thing on my shopping list when the Spendors are Ebayed in the next few weeks.

Will I keep them? Probably (OK certainly) not, but that's not to say I'm in any way disappointed with the first steps on my journey towards the perfect speaker for my system, and I can certainly live with them until something better comes along.

Conclusion - MA's £65, Spendors currently £1700 rrp! You do the math :D

Oh, and to the Doc, love the amps :clap: Am I imagining it, or are they still getting better? Had them a couple of months now.
Bi-amped A80's, P90sa, LS6, AP10h, Phono2/2 PSU's, BMU, SSC, SSP2, Raspberry pi/Durio Sound Dacs, Rega RP6/Dynavector 10x5, Royd RR2.

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Dr Bunsen Honeydew
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Re: What makes for a good soundstage?

Unread post by Dr Bunsen Honeydew »

The better the system the longer you will hear the run in process, yes at a couple of months it could still be showing a small difference. If you are turning the amps off when not being used then definitely they are still coming up.

jammy395
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Re: What makes for a good soundstage?

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To the original post....... 'What make's a good Soundstage'....... :think:

Probably Scaffolding............. :doh:

Sorry i just could not resist....resistance is futile....... :lol:

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applemarc
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Re: What makes for a good soundstage?

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Nice one
Beresford Caiman Ipod

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walterwhite
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Re: What makes for a good soundstage?

Unread post by walterwhite »

Popped over to Coventry this morning, and picked up a pair of Rega ElA Mk 1's. Royd drivers with Scanspeak tweeters. Ad on Ebay said they were a bit tatty, but to me they look pretty much mint, so that was a nice surprise. I think I'm just a slob at heart :) Even smelt nice, patchouli oil I think.

Nice chap, jury rigged them up to some amp and a cdp so I could have a quick listen before parting with the readies, and all was well as far as everything working went, but was quietly disappointed with the sound. Hadn't gone there to haggle though, and accepted that I'd bought them and happily paid up. Didn't hold out much hope of a satisfying outcome - you win some, you lose some :)

Got home, tea and toast (starving), watched a bit of telly, and thought oh well, might as well hook 'em up to the A80's and give them a listen :pray:

First impression (only listened to one CD) - Fucking hell!! Where'd that come from. That can't all be coming from those piddly little drivers can it? Is there another one in the bottom of the cabinet or sumfink? Cymbals! Reverb! Bass with pitch to it, and much, much more. What great fun. Nearly pissed myself laughing at Mark Knopfler singing 'My Parties'. Every word as clear as a bell. No apologies for picking Dire Straits as the audition CD, cos whatever else you think about them, their albums are superbly produced.

Now let's see how they do on all of my other music, I'm sure I'll find something to moan about :D Happy Sunday everybody. Oh, BTW, thanks to the poster who recommended them earlier. Nice one :D
Bi-amped A80's, P90sa, LS6, AP10h, Phono2/2 PSU's, BMU, SSC, SSP2, Raspberry pi/Durio Sound Dacs, Rega RP6/Dynavector 10x5, Royd RR2.

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Re: What makes for a good soundstage?

Unread post by Dr Bunsen Honeydew »

They were nothing to do with Rega, who hadn't a clue how to design and make speakers until Joe Acroyd helped them. These first ones were entirely Royd and Joe's work, they just happen to have the Rega name on them.

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Re: What makes for a good soundstage?

Unread post by guydarryl »

Hi Walter,

So glad that you like them - it was the way that bass tunes can be followed (pitch to it rather than a thump) which first got me interested in a demo room many moons ago.
Female voice can be very seductive through them - give them a Pretenders track and, like you, I just grin ear to ear :D

Unlike a lot of other gear, I think that they look very attractive - did you manage to get wood veneer or black finish?
The patchouli is an added bonus ;) :whistle:

Happy new year. Guy.
LP12, Ittok, DV10X5, Phono2(twin supply), P50SA , Art Audio Quintet, LS5, SSC, Rega Ela mk1
Sony cdp xb930, Alessandro ms1

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