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Daniel Quinn wrote: ↑Sun Dec 05, 2021 5:07 pm It eradicates it from cultural life.

well we do not need a Chopin street - we have Chopin vodka!

and I do not agree, unless you wanna say that some one stays in cultural life only because his/hers name is slapped on the street - but if that's true, then that person probably deserves eradication...

I was doing a little research on the matter and came across this rather decent (imho) article.

https://www.theguardian.com/cities/2016/jun/28/streets-new-names-airbrush-politics-renaming-roads

Grumpytim wrote: ↑Sun Dec 05, 2021 5:16 pm

Also I would venture that the great majority of people have no idea what, where or whom road names relate to.

Very true. Can't remember how many concerts I have been to at the Colston Hall but I did not have a clue how it got its name or give it a thought, until that statue was tipped into the water. And I have a degree in history and one of the courses was the slave trade.

savvypaul wrote: ↑Sun Dec 05, 2021 12:58 pm Savile's View in Scarborough was named after...you guessed it.

The council renamed it. Have they erased history?

Have they renamed it to Doubleplusungood's View?

Jimmy saville will only be remembered in 100 years time if the street name remains. Otherwise he be forgotten.

Most of the ambiguous people who were philanthropists and slave trader have remained in the cultural knowledge of the populace because of statues.

Name me a 17 c slave trader/philanthropist who deos not have a cultural artefact.

I reckon that what gets remembered (and understood) is often related to what gets taught.

We need a more truthful syllabus when it comes to our past.

savvypaul wrote: ↑Sun Dec 05, 2021 9:00 pm I reckon that what gets remembered (and understood) is often related to what gets taught.

We need a more truthful syllabus when it comes to our past.

Which is a much more concise and articulate version of my rambling effort..

Daniel Quinn wrote: ↑Sun Dec 05, 2021 8:35 pm Jimmy saville will only be remembered in 100 years time if the street name remains. Otherwise he be forgotten.

Most of the ambiguous people who were philanthropists and slave trader have remained in the cultural knowledge of the populace because of statues.

Name me a 17 c slave trader/philanthropist who deos not have a cultural artefact.

Time will tell.

The Great Train Robbery
The Moors Murderers
Jack the Ripper

Who remembers them?

Some crimes get a lot of publicity and get absorbed into the national consciousness.

Savile may become a byword for hypocritical predatory behaviour accompanied by institutional apathy.
Or for totally shit TV with an annoying presenter that got huge viewing figures because of prime time slots and a lack of alternatives. Or is that a Noel Edmunds?

Daniel Quinn wrote: ↑Sun Dec 05, 2021 8:35 pm
Name me a 17 c slave trader/philanthropist who deos not have a cultural artefact.

why ?

we do not need to remember them regardless if they have a street named after them
if the only thing they do was philanthropy - as we do not need to remember them for slave trade
it is enough to remember that there WAS slave trade - i would rather remember victims that oppressors...

Grumpytim wrote: ↑Sun Dec 05, 2021 10:24 pm

savvypaul wrote: ↑Sun Dec 05, 2021 9:00 pm I reckon that what gets remembered (and understood) is often related to what gets taught.

We need a more truthful syllabus when it comes to our past.

Which is a much more concise and articulate version of my rambling effort..

I was thinking about history lessons I had at school in the late 70s / early 80s. Slavery was in there, but what was missing was an explanation of just how deeply the money (and other side effects) from the slave trade had built and permeated British institutions. And, when it came to tensions over immigration, no one told me that 'they were only here, because we had already been there'.