Technics 1210 a bargain or a burden?

[_D_S_J_R_]

The arms are a little limited and have that slide in cartridge mount thingy. I think some of the belters are sort of hybrid idler with a toothed belt. I have a 506 inherited which I will have to service at some stage and bring into use. Not even close to a GL75 or Thorens 160 in SQ from memory.

The decks I'm referring to are solidly made, have good, if slightly 'lively' tonearms that are absolutely inert with a good MC fitted, yet delicate enough for a high compliance Empire, Shure or ADC of old. Bearings are state of the art and the idler drives are legendary. Ignore them please, as it'll help keep them affordable for those that know them better Later Duals have gone the ultra-low-mass (and thinner deck plate metal) approach and are very different, although Funk have gone the same way with their tonearms in terms of low mass these days and claim it's not an issue.

The 601 belt drive, and all the Dual belters before the small plastic hub came along, is properly designed with an inflexible belt, a large diameter driving hub and a solid cast and balanced aluminium platter, not a thin shaped 'plate' as on the later and current ones. No speed hunting at all and no motor drone or harmonics coming through that I can tell.

[_D_S_J_R_]

The arms are a little limited and have that slide in cartridge mount thingy. I think some of the belters are sort of hybrid idler with a toothed belt. I have a 506 inherited which I will have to service at some stage and bring into use. Not even close to a GL75 or Thorens 160 in SQ from memory.

The later Dual 500 series sound ok with an OM20 stylus in the supplied Ortofon cartridge (there were a few cartridges, but later ones are Ortofon OM series' derived). The 506 ideally, will need a different mat (I'm fond of cork ones available for a tenner or less) - Dual changed to a solid and heavier rubber one in later 505's and fixing kits for 1/2" mounting do come up from time to time (including an extra counterweight disc). I never tried an XLM or XLM II in one, but I reckon they'd sound superb.

As with all good Hifi products, it's my view that you have to learn how to use them properly and boy, have I been forced to do this recently. Marco has obviously maxed out his Techie and if you broadly follow what he's done, a good sound is fairly well guaranteed I think (so many have heard his deck and love it, it cannot be bad, whatever some may want). I heard the Docs PL71 once and the SPU he uses lacked the over-ripe but musical sound of the earlier ones. All a bit too 'subtle' for me, but I haven't heard it with the full Cubix system, so should wait before saying more.

Progmeister - Do you have the stock arm still? if not, try to get a half decent one complete and send it to Johnnie at Audio origami for fettling. use a Sumiko or similar shell and get speedy Steve to make a massier counterweight if necessary. Also, the ubiquitous Jelco is perfect for this deck and Hugo (Ammonite Acoustics) does a smashing high quality base for it - a (hard) wooden arm-board is recommended and I can see why in this case.

Nowt wrong with a Techie, but as I've been forcibly reminded recently here at home, you need to know how to use them and play to their strengths

[Daniel Quinn]

My advise stop worrying about the techy and play your vinyl on the orbe. This is essentially a non problem

[Classicrock]

Orbe is superb and would only bother with techie or similar if I played a lot of 45's as getting them off a Michell platter is a bit fiddly - this is where ribbed mats make sense.

[alfafan123]

As with all designs each has pros and cons and a lot are over hyped to my mind . Some time ago my stock Techie SL120 something or other left me cold sounding mechanical to me. It seemed unable to communicate the emotional message. Thing is, is it worth spending a lot when the vinyl medium is so variable in quality ?

Also think the more you spend the more serious and important the outcome becomes. Has it been a good investment or is it just offering vanishingly small diminishing returns. The more expensive the less fun it seems to me.

So I take my hat off to Rega for their Planar 3 and RP1 turntables. Properly located and well set up with an R200 or RB101 arm and decent cartridge they can sound fun and very enjoyable for a very small outlay that most people can afford. and you don't have to sit there thinking what a waste of money and get all obsessive about it.

[Classicrock]

Believe me, investing in a better TT can be a lot more fun than a Rega. I don't consider decks like the Orbe or Notts Hyperspace an excessive investment given the returns. It's when you get above this level that return on investment can become questionable.

[Progmeister]

Mmm, had me thinking cap on. The RB250 i fitted to my 1210 originally worked fine. When i fitted the incognito rewired RB300 i ran into hum problems the results of which are posted here and AOS. I have a couple of options, icould send the RB250 away for a rewire in the same configuration or send the RB300 away to have the earth reconfigured retaining the incognito rewire What do we think? I know you hate the Rega arms Doc but this is the cheaper option.

[Shuggie]

It's already been said, but clearly you need a PL-71 - for instance my PL-71

[Classicrock]

Mmm, had me thinking cap on. The RB250 i fitted to my 1210 originally worked fine. When i fitted the incognito rewired RB300 i ran into hum problems the results of which are posted here and AOS. I have a couple of options, icould send the RB250 away for a rewire in the same configuration or send the RB300 away to have the earth reconfigured retaining the incognito rewire What do we think? I know you hate the Rega arms Doc but this is the cheaper option.

If you still have the RB250 fit a Technoweight and use as standard. Obviously the original Rega earth arrangement works. The improved counterweights make more difference than fancy wires. Origin live used to claim 90% improvement was their counter weight and 10% the rewire. It's not your main deck anyway. It's possible the rewire with separate earth has bypassed earthing through the arm base or the opposite in creating an earth loop.

[Dr Bunsen Honeydew]

It's already been said, but clearly you need a PL-71 - for instance my PL-71

Price?