Your favourite Richard Dunn quotes?
- savvypaul
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Your favourite Richard Dunn quotes?
What are your favourite Richard Dunn hi-fi quotes?
We want to compile Richard's' wisdoms' to make an article for the NVA website.
Please post the quote and the link to the page on the forum where you got it from.
Many thanks,
Paul & Tom
PS. I can also see us doing a 'Memories of Richard' post for NVA's 40th anniversary celebrations, so please post any anecdotes, also. Cheers!
We want to compile Richard's' wisdoms' to make an article for the NVA website.
Please post the quote and the link to the page on the forum where you got it from.
Many thanks,
Paul & Tom
PS. I can also see us doing a 'Memories of Richard' post for NVA's 40th anniversary celebrations, so please post any anecdotes, also. Cheers!
- Lindsayt
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Re: Your favourite Richard Dunn quotes?
Here's Richard's thoughts on Blind Tests, from a couple of posts of his:
Welder I spent years doing blind listening tests for Hi-Fi Choice, they are a load of bollocks and a waste of time. It takes away the pleasure of listening and turns it into a job, it creates a totally different mind set, and with most people who aren't used to the process it creates stress related audio blindness (deafness).
Music is a completely artistic and subjective subject, it has NOTHING to do with the hi-fi it only has to do with the music. In your personal case as you make things you think it serves a purpose. I make things and it serves no purpose I KNOW what is better by just listening not by getting involved with all this bollocks. It has become the rod for the objectivists to try and beat on the back of the subjectivists. As I have explained over and over and over again we enjoy music as a response to out internal energetic systems and they require a whole human to function properly. Cut out one set of senses and the others stress. It would be the same if you sat and listened in a body suit that removed you ability to feel. So feeling things is not part of music, well wrong!! and if you did it the rest of your senses would stress and the results would be no results which is what the objectivists want us to perceive. It is an idiots solution to choosing hi-fi, you might as well do it with an oscilloscope, which most of them really want so they can tell us what to buy.
ITS ALL BULLSHIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
2nd post:
I hate "agree to differ" as it is used by some (well one in particular) to shut up the debate. For me I am strong in my opinion because of people like Jammy who get sucked into the concept as it seems to make sense on paper. My view is that the reality is different and newbys to the process will not get anything from it and often walk away converted to the objectivist creed without understanding why, and then they start to question their own judgement within their own system, which is a slippery slope to ending up with bland crap, which is what Quad (and others) marketing relied on.
Objectivist reviewing ruled the roost in the 60's and early 70's, and sometimes the equipment was only measured and not even listened to based on these very same arguments. Do we really want to go back to that time.
Source: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=44759&p=85424&hilit ... sts#p85424
Related to this is one of my all time favourite posts from Richard:
Much that I hate to agree with him I am afraid the 44's and most of the Celestions are smeared and foggy in nature for me, especially the 15 which has a bass like lumpy semolina.
They can be much improved by the usual cabinet stiffening / plate lining and removing damping and simplifying crossover but they are a bit of a lost cause. Where as the Goodmans aren't, much can be made of Magnums and Magisters, and even Goodwoods but Minsters are a bit duff though.
I haven't heard many B&W's as when I do I am always dissapointed. I remember a session at the Hi-Fi Choice blind tests at Paul Messengers gaff in Herne Bay. On the team that day was a B&W corporate wanker as there were new B&W in the test. Well so was a small pair of JPW's and they pissed all over the large B&W musically. The twat in a suit was trying to do his bullshit marketing bit and then when his speakers came on he marked them down not a clue
Source: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=44759&p=77321&hilit ... est#p77321
Welder I spent years doing blind listening tests for Hi-Fi Choice, they are a load of bollocks and a waste of time. It takes away the pleasure of listening and turns it into a job, it creates a totally different mind set, and with most people who aren't used to the process it creates stress related audio blindness (deafness).
Music is a completely artistic and subjective subject, it has NOTHING to do with the hi-fi it only has to do with the music. In your personal case as you make things you think it serves a purpose. I make things and it serves no purpose I KNOW what is better by just listening not by getting involved with all this bollocks. It has become the rod for the objectivists to try and beat on the back of the subjectivists. As I have explained over and over and over again we enjoy music as a response to out internal energetic systems and they require a whole human to function properly. Cut out one set of senses and the others stress. It would be the same if you sat and listened in a body suit that removed you ability to feel. So feeling things is not part of music, well wrong!! and if you did it the rest of your senses would stress and the results would be no results which is what the objectivists want us to perceive. It is an idiots solution to choosing hi-fi, you might as well do it with an oscilloscope, which most of them really want so they can tell us what to buy.
ITS ALL BULLSHIT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
2nd post:
I hate "agree to differ" as it is used by some (well one in particular) to shut up the debate. For me I am strong in my opinion because of people like Jammy who get sucked into the concept as it seems to make sense on paper. My view is that the reality is different and newbys to the process will not get anything from it and often walk away converted to the objectivist creed without understanding why, and then they start to question their own judgement within their own system, which is a slippery slope to ending up with bland crap, which is what Quad (and others) marketing relied on.
Objectivist reviewing ruled the roost in the 60's and early 70's, and sometimes the equipment was only measured and not even listened to based on these very same arguments. Do we really want to go back to that time.
Source: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=44759&p=85424&hilit ... sts#p85424
Related to this is one of my all time favourite posts from Richard:
Much that I hate to agree with him I am afraid the 44's and most of the Celestions are smeared and foggy in nature for me, especially the 15 which has a bass like lumpy semolina.
They can be much improved by the usual cabinet stiffening / plate lining and removing damping and simplifying crossover but they are a bit of a lost cause. Where as the Goodmans aren't, much can be made of Magnums and Magisters, and even Goodwoods but Minsters are a bit duff though.
I haven't heard many B&W's as when I do I am always dissapointed. I remember a session at the Hi-Fi Choice blind tests at Paul Messengers gaff in Herne Bay. On the team that day was a B&W corporate wanker as there were new B&W in the test. Well so was a small pair of JPW's and they pissed all over the large B&W musically. The twat in a suit was trying to do his bullshit marketing bit and then when his speakers came on he marked them down not a clue
Source: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=44759&p=77321&hilit ... est#p77321
- Latteman
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Re: Your favourite Richard Dunn quotes?
Don’t remember the post but I always liked
“Belts are for trousers”
I’ll have a nosey around later
“Belts are for trousers”
I’ll have a nosey around later
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Doug Self balanced Pre amp
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Tidal / Radio Paradise
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Re: Your favourite Richard Dunn quotes?
I have come across these.
Most speakers fight the room, in which case it is just chance, and some speakers (very few) work with the room.
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=49801&p=185756#p185756
Basically Class D is a non linear circuit same as non linear power supply, as in its simplest form an amp is a power supply regulated by the music. I think we all hear the difference between a Linear PSU and Switched-mode Power supply. That argument is almost won, or is with people who have ears, now we need to understand Switched-mode amplifiers have the same problems and deficiencies.
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=49812&p=185607#p185607
I am objecting purely to the bullshit marketing process of using balanced to create some sort of delusionary advantage to the music - it doesn't and it cannot. BUT you have to do something different to get you to stand out from the crowd, so things like balanced and active crossovers have been borrowed from the Pro industry to try and create a marketing advantage - that is THE ENTIRE reality behind this - it is marketing, not better music.
The way I am trying to stand out from the crowd is price and musical excellence. Call that a marketing ploy if you want, but I wouldn't do it if I couldn't do it, then I would have to search for some marketing bullshit like they do.
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=49677&p=182899#p182899
Most speakers fight the room, in which case it is just chance, and some speakers (very few) work with the room.
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=49801&p=185756#p185756
Basically Class D is a non linear circuit same as non linear power supply, as in its simplest form an amp is a power supply regulated by the music. I think we all hear the difference between a Linear PSU and Switched-mode Power supply. That argument is almost won, or is with people who have ears, now we need to understand Switched-mode amplifiers have the same problems and deficiencies.
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=49812&p=185607#p185607
I am objecting purely to the bullshit marketing process of using balanced to create some sort of delusionary advantage to the music - it doesn't and it cannot. BUT you have to do something different to get you to stand out from the crowd, so things like balanced and active crossovers have been borrowed from the Pro industry to try and create a marketing advantage - that is THE ENTIRE reality behind this - it is marketing, not better music.
The way I am trying to stand out from the crowd is price and musical excellence. Call that a marketing ploy if you want, but I wouldn't do it if I couldn't do it, then I would have to search for some marketing bullshit like they do.
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=49677&p=182899#p182899
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Re: Your favourite Richard Dunn quotes?
This is a good one.
Modern speakers are bling crap largely, and sold with layers of bullshit all over them - Harbeth is a classic case. Just look at their ludicrous denial that amplifiers can sound different. The only important thing being the speaker, that is how they are getting away with it as decent amps will show them up for what they are. The IMPORTANT thing is speakers that show how good good amplifiers are, and the IMPORTANT thing is amplifiers that show how good the source components are, and the IMPORTANT thing is source components that show how good the music is.......
viewtopic.php?f=17&t=48285&start=20
and this
It is very simple like all things done right in audio work. If a driver has problems or is not quite right for the job then you have two choices - do it electrically or do it mechanically. Electrically is a problem as it changes the phase (timing) relationships of the signal (music) across the band being tailored, this is musically destructive, and the more complex that electrical circuit the more of a problem - or do it mechanically, which means doping and tailoring the driver to make it a mechanically more acceptable compromise. The major purpose of the damping / doping is to control the HF response of what is a relatively large driver for dealing with HF work as the response becomes peaky as resonance points are reached in the shape and materials the driver is made from. Doping puts material of other resonant frequency in to infill the nulls (suck outs) and flatten the nodes (peaks). This is a partial success for solving the problem as the driver will still harden up and distort the HF output.
So now we come to the other trick up the sleeve of the Cubes - directionality. Differing frequencies have differing dispersion patterns. The lower the frequency the more omni directional is the polar response, and the higher the frequency the more directional. So our trick is to mount the driver upward firing as the higher it gets in frequency the less it is heard from the listening position and the more its output just contributes to the acoustic ambience of the music (which is peaky anyway due to room nodes). We then use a relatively wide band tweeter which is front firing and directional to provide the frequency range beyond the point the bass / mid driver is naturally (due to doping) and acoustically (due to directionality) rolling off. This makes the only crossover components in the whole speaker necessary as a series protection capacitor to gently roll off the tweeter down to low mid and LF frequencies which would overload and distort (and potentially damage) the small driver, and a padding resistor as the upward driver loses some of the efficiency of output at MF and LF, so if left that way the tweeter would dominate, so it needs taming a little.
The other advantage of the upward firing driver is that it means it is mechanically in phase with its coupling to the listening room, the speaker stand. This stops any rocking motion which induces mf and hf phase problems and a large (90degree) LF phase change as with normal front firing speakers in very low frequency notes. The other bonus of the LF driver position means you get an extra LF natural mechanical extension of the bass frequency so no extra LF driver or extra bass boom box is required.
The other problem / consideration is what is this all enclosed in and how that enclosure functions. In this situation in reality you are looking at a small box (speaker) creating sound within a much larger box (the room). Now this is a whole new subject in terms of materials, shape and size, better left to another post
viewtopic.php?f=29&t=45653
Modern speakers are bling crap largely, and sold with layers of bullshit all over them - Harbeth is a classic case. Just look at their ludicrous denial that amplifiers can sound different. The only important thing being the speaker, that is how they are getting away with it as decent amps will show them up for what they are. The IMPORTANT thing is speakers that show how good good amplifiers are, and the IMPORTANT thing is amplifiers that show how good the source components are, and the IMPORTANT thing is source components that show how good the music is.......
viewtopic.php?f=17&t=48285&start=20
and this
It is very simple like all things done right in audio work. If a driver has problems or is not quite right for the job then you have two choices - do it electrically or do it mechanically. Electrically is a problem as it changes the phase (timing) relationships of the signal (music) across the band being tailored, this is musically destructive, and the more complex that electrical circuit the more of a problem - or do it mechanically, which means doping and tailoring the driver to make it a mechanically more acceptable compromise. The major purpose of the damping / doping is to control the HF response of what is a relatively large driver for dealing with HF work as the response becomes peaky as resonance points are reached in the shape and materials the driver is made from. Doping puts material of other resonant frequency in to infill the nulls (suck outs) and flatten the nodes (peaks). This is a partial success for solving the problem as the driver will still harden up and distort the HF output.
So now we come to the other trick up the sleeve of the Cubes - directionality. Differing frequencies have differing dispersion patterns. The lower the frequency the more omni directional is the polar response, and the higher the frequency the more directional. So our trick is to mount the driver upward firing as the higher it gets in frequency the less it is heard from the listening position and the more its output just contributes to the acoustic ambience of the music (which is peaky anyway due to room nodes). We then use a relatively wide band tweeter which is front firing and directional to provide the frequency range beyond the point the bass / mid driver is naturally (due to doping) and acoustically (due to directionality) rolling off. This makes the only crossover components in the whole speaker necessary as a series protection capacitor to gently roll off the tweeter down to low mid and LF frequencies which would overload and distort (and potentially damage) the small driver, and a padding resistor as the upward driver loses some of the efficiency of output at MF and LF, so if left that way the tweeter would dominate, so it needs taming a little.
The other advantage of the upward firing driver is that it means it is mechanically in phase with its coupling to the listening room, the speaker stand. This stops any rocking motion which induces mf and hf phase problems and a large (90degree) LF phase change as with normal front firing speakers in very low frequency notes. The other bonus of the LF driver position means you get an extra LF natural mechanical extension of the bass frequency so no extra LF driver or extra bass boom box is required.
The other problem / consideration is what is this all enclosed in and how that enclosure functions. In this situation in reality you are looking at a small box (speaker) creating sound within a much larger box (the room). Now this is a whole new subject in terms of materials, shape and size, better left to another post
viewtopic.php?f=29&t=45653
Main System
NVA BMU, P90SA/A80s (latest spec), Cube 1s, TIS, TISC(LS7)
Sonore OpticalRendu, Chord Mscaler & Qutest, Sbooster PSs
Network Acoustics Eno, ifi iPurifier3, AQ JB FMJ, Cisco 2940 & 2960
DH Labs ethernet, BNC & USB cables, Lindy cat 6 US ethernet cable
Second System
NVA P20/ A20, Cubettes, LS3, SSP, SC
Sonore MicroRendu, Chord Mojo 2 MCRU PSs, AQ Carbon USB cable & JB FMJ
Headphones
Grado SR325e/Chord Mojo, Beyerdynamic Avetho/AQ DF Colbat
RIP Doc
NVA BMU, P90SA/A80s (latest spec), Cube 1s, TIS, TISC(LS7)
Sonore OpticalRendu, Chord Mscaler & Qutest, Sbooster PSs
Network Acoustics Eno, ifi iPurifier3, AQ JB FMJ, Cisco 2940 & 2960
DH Labs ethernet, BNC & USB cables, Lindy cat 6 US ethernet cable
Second System
NVA P20/ A20, Cubettes, LS3, SSP, SC
Sonore MicroRendu, Chord Mojo 2 MCRU PSs, AQ Carbon USB cable & JB FMJ
Headphones
Grado SR325e/Chord Mojo, Beyerdynamic Avetho/AQ DF Colbat
RIP Doc
- karatestu
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Re: Your favourite Richard Dunn quotes?
"Listen mate eat loads of cakes and put on loads of weight and see if you bounce up and down as easily
Per usual they look at it wrong, it is pressure wave, it doesn't reflect it either turns the cabinet into a transducer, or the rigidity of Doc Mods or NVA cabs *transmits* that energy to physical earth. So little understanding THAT is what the wadding is there for not for reflections back to the cone, which is a nonsense, just look at the wavelengths involved, it is basic physics. A majority of midrange and all bass will be ignored as the wavelengths are too long, and if they seriously think HF is going to get through a bass cone and out the other side PLUS FFS that bass driver has had all HF removed either by crossover or if like me by doping the cone.
Acoustic suspension / infinite baffle turns the enclosure air into a slightly compressible solid, so the cabinet thinks it is the back of the drive unit and wants to move in unison with it, you have to stop it - do you understand now
This is why air leaks in IBs / ASs mess up the speaker so much."
Now go post that on PFM (or any other acoustically challenged forum you can think of).
Per usual they look at it wrong, it is pressure wave, it doesn't reflect it either turns the cabinet into a transducer, or the rigidity of Doc Mods or NVA cabs *transmits* that energy to physical earth. So little understanding THAT is what the wadding is there for not for reflections back to the cone, which is a nonsense, just look at the wavelengths involved, it is basic physics. A majority of midrange and all bass will be ignored as the wavelengths are too long, and if they seriously think HF is going to get through a bass cone and out the other side PLUS FFS that bass driver has had all HF removed either by crossover or if like me by doping the cone.
Acoustic suspension / infinite baffle turns the enclosure air into a slightly compressible solid, so the cabinet thinks it is the back of the drive unit and wants to move in unison with it, you have to stop it - do you understand now
This is why air leaks in IBs / ASs mess up the speaker so much."
Now go post that on PFM (or any other acoustically challenged forum you can think of).
- These users thanked the author karatestu for the post (total 2):
- Lindsayt (Fri Dec 30, 2022 2:29 am) • CycleCoach (Sat Dec 31, 2022 1:07 pm)
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Re: Your favourite Richard Dunn quotes?
Forgot to put a link up but is pfm thread on eotw. God, looking back in the archives I could keep this thread going forever. When Richard said he was telling the truth about audio it is my opinion that he really was.
- These users thanked the author karatestu for the post (total 2):
- Lindsayt (Fri Dec 30, 2022 8:32 pm) • CycleCoach (Sat Dec 31, 2022 1:07 pm)
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Re: Your favourite Richard Dunn quotes?
You'll be preaching to the converted here, Stu. You're still a member at PFM?
I think there will always be some ignorance and misinformation on the internet, on any subject, and for a variety of reasons. Sometimes, a little knowledge is a dangerous thing. Sometimes personal grievances, even historical.ones, mean that critical analysis is rapidly bypassed. Hifi is not immune.
The new Cube prototypes garnered lots of positive comments at the two shows we did last year. They were described as open, natural, musical, unforced, with remarkable scale and image for a compact speaker, and capable of doing that great trick of visually disappearing. No one speaker is everyone's cup of tea, but I rate the comments of people who have listened to Cubes with an open mind and without an agenda, over the bitter ramblings of any self declared forum guru.
- These users thanked the author savvypaul for the post (total 4):
- karatestu (Fri Dec 30, 2022 4:00 pm) • SteveTheShadow (Fri Dec 30, 2022 4:33 pm) • Lindsayt (Fri Dec 30, 2022 8:33 pm) • CycleCoach (Sat Dec 31, 2022 1:08 pm)
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Re: Your favourite Richard Dunn quotes?
Not particularly hi-fi related, but the one that sticks with me went something like, " Paul? Richard. I think we've been hacked".
I didn't even know he had my bloody phone number.
I didn't even know he had my bloody phone number.
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Re: Your favourite Richard Dunn quotes?
Yeah I'm still a member. That quote came from the pfm thread in eotw and as you can see, reading some of that had put me in a certain mood shall we say.savvypaul wrote: ↑Fri Dec 30, 2022 11:08 amYou'll be preaching to the converted here, Stu. You're still a member at PFM?
I think there will always be some ignorance and misinformation on the internet, on any subject, and for a variety of reasons. Sometimes, a little knowledge is a dangerous thing. Sometimes personal grievances, even historical.ones, mean that critical analysis is rapidly bypassed. Hifi is not immune.
The new Cube prototypes garnered lots of positive comments at the two shows we did last year. They were described as open, natural, musical, unforced, with remarkable scale and image for a compact speaker, and capable of doing that great trick of visually disappearing. No one speaker is everyone's cup of tea, but I rate the comments of people who have listened to Cubes with an open mind and without an agenda, over the bitter ramblings of any self declared forum guru.
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