bought a reel to reel...........

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Vinyl-ant
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bought a reel to reel...........

Unread post by Vinyl-ant »

Had an urge to scratch the itch to try an rtr machine.
Did some research to see what sort of machine would be a good starter machine, and decided on a Sony TC 377.

Here it is in all its early 70s teakness

ImageSony tc377 by anthony cresswell, on Flickr

I paid 200 quid for it, as a working and tested machine in need of a service. Cosmetic condition is very very good, there is only one small scratch in the black paint and a couple of small stickers on the side near the audio connectors, and one of the pins that the tape head cover sits on is broken. i'll just make another one on the lathe, its just a threaded pin so not a problem. otherwise, it's nigh on perfect.

This didn't get off to a good start, as when it arrived the machine would not play, and the rewind function wouldn't work properly. the rewind issue sorted itself out, and some vindictive turning of the tape speed control accompanied by various curses and threats finally got the idler mechanism for play to engage.

the transport is noisy, but its working well enough to have a quick blast of it, and to be very encouraged by the noises that come out of it.

I was well pissed off that it wouldn't work, as I bought it as working and tested, it almost went back. I gave it one last chance this morning before I boxed it up. its a good job it listened to the swearing and threats, and coughed back into life, otherwise it'd be in the back of a postie van at this moment.

I'll pull it apart and give it a good clean, a new set of belts and go through the linkages to clean and re lubricate them. also wants the tape path cleaning, the pinch roller is filthy, and so are the heads. its running a little slow, so the flywheel, idlers and reel spindles will all get a good going over.

the sound that came out of it in its current state piqued my interest hard, but as the bloody kids are at home doing lessons on teams, I'm not even going to attempt any work on it until they are out of the way. It's far too complicated to even try when there is no space to work and a quiet environment.

for now, i'll just have to look at it, but its a cool thing to look at. onwards!
These users thanked the author Vinyl-ant for the post (total 4):
karatestu (Thu Jan 14, 2021 8:35 pm) • slinger (Thu Jan 14, 2021 9:52 pm) • savvypaul (Thu Jan 14, 2021 10:50 pm) • Geoff.R.G (Fri Jan 15, 2021 3:08 pm)
Analogue: oracle delphi sme 309, jbe series 3 cx unipivot dv20x2l, roksan xerxes tabriz vm750, jvc ql-y5f rigb at440, jvc ql-y3f vm750, lenco 75, technics sl150

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karatestu
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Re: bought a reel to reel...........

Unread post by karatestu »

Analogue baby :dance:

Have you got owt to play on it ?
DIY FREE ZONE

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Re: bought a reel to reel...........

Unread post by Vinyl-ant »

Just the tape it came with
I was expecting mantovani, cliff richard or born bloody free, but its some sort of interesting classical piece
Analogue: oracle delphi sme 309, jbe series 3 cx unipivot dv20x2l, roksan xerxes tabriz vm750, jvc ql-y5f rigb at440, jvc ql-y3f vm750, lenco 75, technics sl150

Phono stages: cole lcr, benedict audio hothead

Digital: cyrus cd7, wiim mini x2, topping e30, jds labs el dac 2+

Amplification: nelson pass b1, nelson pass f5

Speakers: 15" fane aperiodic wardrobes

Cans: myryad z40, hifiman sundara + deva, fostex t50rp, sennheiser momentum on ear +over ear, b&w p5 and p7

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Re: bought a reel to reel...........

Unread post by Geoff.R.G »

I have three of them, an Akai 4000D I've had for nearly 50 years, a Teac X10, for nearly 40 years and a Tascam 38 (1/2" 8 track)
Enjoy your new toy.
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Musicmadmaniam (Sat Feb 05, 2022 10:53 pm)

antonio66
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Re: bought a reel to reel...........

Unread post by antonio66 »

I see quite a number of people are into R2R's these days, but what are you going to play on it? Tapes are hugely expensive, so are you just going o record your vinyl?

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Re: bought a reel to reel...........

Unread post by Geoff.R.G »

antonio66 wrote: Fri Jan 15, 2021 1:23 am I see quite a number of people are into R2R's these days, but what are you going to play on it? Tapes are hugely expensive, so are you just going o record your vinyl?
Most of my material on tape was recorded using a variety of FM tuners to record concerts. As an example I have Harry Chapin's Dominion TCR concert recorded from Capital Radio, I was in the hall at the time. It was his last London concert.

Other material is recordings of other concerts I attended, mainly classical. Tape has always been relatively expensive and for those of us using 10.5" reels even more so as metal reels are now more expensive than the tape! Tape speed is an important consideration, too low a speed restricts the ability to record high frequencies and too high a speed limits the recording duration, no problem if you are using 1/4" tape but 1/2" tape is usually thicker and thus a 10.5" reel at 15 ips gives just 30 minutes (the Tascam 38 uses the full width of the 1/2" tape so one side only).

Some people are fortunate enough to be able to record live sessions on tape but a computer and an interface is more convenient, cheaper and, at the right sample rate, higher quality. There is however something about tape that is more satisfying than using a computer.
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antonio66 (Sat Jan 16, 2021 12:56 am)

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Re: bought a reel to reel...........

Unread post by Geoff.R.G »

Vinyl-ant wrote: Thu Jan 14, 2021 8:32 pm I'll pull it apart and give it a good clean, a new set of belts and go through the linkages to clean and re lubricate them. also wants the tape path cleaning, the pinch roller is filthy, and so are the heads. its running a little slow, so the flywheel, idlers and reel spindles will all get a good going over.
May I suggest that you look here https://www.hifiengine.com/ for the manuals before you start taking it to pieces.

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Re: bought a reel to reel...........

Unread post by Vinyl-ant »

I've got both the service manual and the normal consumer operating manual for the machine already, I anticipated it needing some fettling and service work and got hold of them before I paid for the machine. I also checked spares available which seems to be quite good, albeit bits from parted out machines making up the majority wih a smattering of nos bits. It was mainly chosen for the heads being reportedly pretty robust, they are the killer bit. Idlers can be rebuilt and motors rewound (maybe not in the case of this machine as it was never 'high end' so youd have to be pretty attached to it to go to the trouble), but heads are the unobtanium bit. If they are buggered, job stops.

Ive had a little poke about, and it seems to me thats its a cleverly simple mech this one having eyeballed it up close. They dont seem to have designed it to be any more complicated than it needs to be. Dont get me wrong, its still a proper jigsaw puzzle, but an elegant one.

Ive put it back as it was (just moved the main plates so i could see behind them), i'll order a new set of belts, a lifetimes supply of cotton buds, some sewing machine oil, some molyslip for the metal/metal contact areas of the linkages, and some ipa.

It will require patience, a clear workbench, and some quiet to do it properly, definitely not a job to go into half arsed
Analogue: oracle delphi sme 309, jbe series 3 cx unipivot dv20x2l, roksan xerxes tabriz vm750, jvc ql-y5f rigb at440, jvc ql-y3f vm750, lenco 75, technics sl150

Phono stages: cole lcr, benedict audio hothead

Digital: cyrus cd7, wiim mini x2, topping e30, jds labs el dac 2+

Amplification: nelson pass b1, nelson pass f5

Speakers: 15" fane aperiodic wardrobes

Cans: myryad z40, hifiman sundara + deva, fostex t50rp, sennheiser momentum on ear +over ear, b&w p5 and p7

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Re: bought a reel to reel...........

Unread post by Geoff.R.G »

Obviously you were well ahead of me. The mechanics of the Teac and Tascam machines are simpler than the Akai, perhaps unsurprisingly because the first two come from the same manufacturer. High end solenoid controlled decks are more expensive but simpler mechanically, the electronics for the tape drive system making up the cost and overall complexity. The audio circuits are pretty standard.

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Re: bought a reel to reel...........

Unread post by Vinyl-ant »

Well ive spent a rather pleasurable and productive afternoon fixing the r2r.
I found out what the initial problem was, and what the big 'clonk' was when it started to work.
The mech is quite clever in how one motor spinning at a single speed performs all the functions.

At the top of the machine between the 2 reel tables there are a pair of idlers. The right hand reel table is driven anticlockwise by a belt from the flywheel whose bearing shaft doubles as the capstan. The pinch roller comes forward and up to rest on this shaft with the tape inbetween.

The flywheel has 2 drive surfaces, which are driven by an idler which moves forward and backward, to 3 fixed positions. These positions correspond with 3 steps on the motor pulley.

The 2 idlers at the top, are the rewind mech, they move together to reverse the motion, driving the left hand reel table clockwise.

So ive stripped it and rebuilt all 3 idlers and used lithium grease for the shafts, and fitted a complet set of belts.

The problem it had was with the speed change control.

It has a rotating plastic ramp that pushes the idler wheel forward, (towards the front face of the machine) or allows it to go backwards (towards the back of the machine) under spring pressure if its rotated the other way. The idler arm itsself slides on a pair of rods. The arm was stuck on one of the rods so it was not able to move backwards under spring pressure when the cam surface was turned.
The clonk was it momentarily freeing up and dropping back under the spring pressure. Because it was stuck, and the articulated part of the linkage which allows it to move left and right into the correct position the engage the flywheel and motor pulley was also stuck, the rest of the mech moved and trapped it in place where it wasnt touching any drive surface at all.

So it now goes at 3 speeds.

There was huge slack in all the belts apart from the tape counter belt which was in bits in the bottom so all have been replaced, all the drive surfaces have been cleaned with ipa, the heads and tape path have been cleaned with ipa, and all the idlers and pinch roller have been cleaned with ipa then treated with rubber renue. Which stinks.

Hopefully, it plays, the transport functions correctly, but i havent hooked it up yet. I hope ive not disturbed any of the head wiring by doing any of this and broken something.

It was actually a nice job to do and to figure out how it works.

Crossed fingers
These users thanked the author Vinyl-ant for the post:
savvypaul (Fri Jan 29, 2021 10:22 pm)
Analogue: oracle delphi sme 309, jbe series 3 cx unipivot dv20x2l, roksan xerxes tabriz vm750, jvc ql-y5f rigb at440, jvc ql-y3f vm750, lenco 75, technics sl150

Phono stages: cole lcr, benedict audio hothead

Digital: cyrus cd7, wiim mini x2, topping e30, jds labs el dac 2+

Amplification: nelson pass b1, nelson pass f5

Speakers: 15" fane aperiodic wardrobes

Cans: myryad z40, hifiman sundara + deva, fostex t50rp, sennheiser momentum on ear +over ear, b&w p5 and p7

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