Can you publish a list of Dacs that are suspected of causing amp damage? Just so they can be avoided. What damage was done?Dr Bunsen Honeydew wrote: ↑Thu Feb 21, 2019 2:27 pm I am highly suspicious of recently designed DACs and their RF performance, and I am sure some NVA amps have been damaged by them. It reminded me of the arseholes at the BBC back in the early 70's suddenly making speaker 10 times more complicated and blaming some of the amps around then for not coping with them - cart before horse - cart before horse !!!!!!!!!
EVERY TIME in music when you complicate things you make them worse musically and more difficult to accommodate - it is ludicrous and all for the sake of finding a bullshit to help YOU part with your money.
Digital Upscaling
- Classicrock
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Re: Digital Upscaling
I Know What I like (In Your Wardrobe)
- Dr Bunsen Honeydew
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Re: Digital Upscaling
No I can't, it has been suspicious failures only in systems with these expensive Dacs with programmable chips. It is at a level of suspicion ATM. Old style Dacs seem to be fine. I really do not want to change the amp design just to cater for their stoooopidity. Same as 40 years ago with BBC design and litz cables.
Output stage failure.
Output stage failure.
- CN211276
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Re: Digital Upscaling
My NVA amps have been fine with the Chord Mojo, Qutest and Mscaler.
Main System
NVA BMU, P90SA/A80s (latest spec), Cube 1s, TIS, TISC(LS7)
Sonore OpticalRendu, Chord Mscaler & Qutest, Sbooster PSs
Network Acoustics Eno, ifi iPurifier3, AQ JB FMJ, Cisco 2940 & 2960
DH Labs ethernet, BNC & USB cables, Lindy cat 6 US ethernet cable
Second System
NVA P20/ A20, Cubettes, LS3, SSP, SC
Sonore MicroRendu, Chord Mojo 2 MCRU PSs, AQ Carbon USB cable & JB FMJ
Headphones
Grado SR325e/Chord Mojo, Beyerdynamic Avetho/AQ DF Colbat
RIP Doc
NVA BMU, P90SA/A80s (latest spec), Cube 1s, TIS, TISC(LS7)
Sonore OpticalRendu, Chord Mscaler & Qutest, Sbooster PSs
Network Acoustics Eno, ifi iPurifier3, AQ JB FMJ, Cisco 2940 & 2960
DH Labs ethernet, BNC & USB cables, Lindy cat 6 US ethernet cable
Second System
NVA P20/ A20, Cubettes, LS3, SSP, SC
Sonore MicroRendu, Chord Mojo 2 MCRU PSs, AQ Carbon USB cable & JB FMJ
Headphones
Grado SR325e/Chord Mojo, Beyerdynamic Avetho/AQ DF Colbat
RIP Doc
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Re: Digital Upscaling
The DAC I looked at that was causing problems didnt seem to have a reconstruction filter on the output and looked like it was not over/up sampling so you could see staircase steps on the output. If that's the sort of HF content that's using you problems Richard maybe a low pass filter on the amp input if it had no detriment might be worth considering?Dr Bunsen Honeydew wrote: ↑Thu Feb 21, 2019 5:50 pm No I can't, it has been suspicious failures only in systems with these expensive Dacs with programmable chips. It is at a level of suspicion ATM. Old style Dacs seem to be fine. I really do not want to change the amp design just to cater for their stoooopidity. Same as 40 years ago with BBC design and litz cables.
Output stage failure.
- Dr Bunsen Honeydew
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Re: Digital Upscaling
That is my point, why should I change my designs to cater for eeeediots, IF they have created a problem, so don't do it.
I still repeat over and over again I do not understand people paying stupid amounts for DACs just because they are flavour of the month or have created a new bullshit. I can assure you I won't be changing. It is the sickness of this hobby.
These DACs would have to be massively better at that price to justify it, and they aren't, £5 Dac and my amps are happy. It may be a combo of things if CN is fine, but it should be borne in mind.
I still repeat over and over again I do not understand people paying stupid amounts for DACs just because they are flavour of the month or have created a new bullshit. I can assure you I won't be changing. It is the sickness of this hobby.
These DACs would have to be massively better at that price to justify it, and they aren't, £5 Dac and my amps are happy. It may be a combo of things if CN is fine, but it should be borne in mind.
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Re: Digital Upscaling
Apparently, red-book DACs of old don't really have this issue as they're pretty well filtered apparently. Some of the TDA 1541 DACs had small spikes at 75k or so (I remember from Paul Miller tests and confirmed more recently in odd tests on ASR site) but this isn't where we're talking. It really seems to be audiophile 'stuff' that's been bodged away from the chip makers application notes. Seeing some of the shit apparently coming out of modern DACs when old stuff was actually cleaner 'up there' is a bit frightening though...
I've seen a test of a DAC that appears to be a version of 'our' generic cheapy, only it offers USB as well as optical and coax inputs. It's perfect for red-book CD and streaming equivalents and seemed to be prety well balanced for that role, the negatives being noise, which is still lower than audibility rather than nasty bits of distortion - the lower output was noted though, but that's not a problem really. Anything above this model is largely academic I suspect, but whether you could reliably tell the difference between a Qutest and a sub £100 Topping, level matched and blindfold I have no idea...
I've seen a test of a DAC that appears to be a version of 'our' generic cheapy, only it offers USB as well as optical and coax inputs. It's perfect for red-book CD and streaming equivalents and seemed to be prety well balanced for that role, the negatives being noise, which is still lower than audibility rather than nasty bits of distortion - the lower output was noted though, but that's not a problem really. Anything above this model is largely academic I suspect, but whether you could reliably tell the difference between a Qutest and a sub £100 Topping, level matched and blindfold I have no idea...
Hanging on in quiet desperation is the English way...The time has gone, The song is over, Thought I'd something more to say...
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Re: Digital Upscaling
I like my Arcam Delta black box NOS using TDA1541 (S1 after upgrade) older than my kids - still very musical
At CJ London I tried mscaler - with some top HPs - - show environment etc. but I could not hear a difference.
Chord DACs are very dry musically to my ears - not a big fan of those - I tried at home for 2 weeks smallest
one from them Mojo - Like my Arcam and Grace m9xx more
At CJ London I tried mscaler - with some top HPs - - show environment etc. but I could not hear a difference.
Chord DACs are very dry musically to my ears - not a big fan of those - I tried at home for 2 weeks smallest
one from them Mojo - Like my Arcam and Grace m9xx more
Nothing to see here...
I am in the hi-fi trade
Status: Manufacturer
Company Name: NVA Hi-Fi
https://nvahifi.co.uk/
I am in the hi-fi trade
Status: Manufacturer
Company Name: NVA Hi-Fi
https://nvahifi.co.uk/
- Dr Bunsen Honeydew
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Re: Digital Upscaling
It strikes me of the usual conundrum of Hi-Fi v Music. It is extremely difficult to get both, so which is more important when you can't get perfection.
- karatestu
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Re: Digital Upscaling
I can only completely agree with this (in my limited experience). I read of somebody removing the anologue output stage in their Naim CD3.5 - in fact they had it done professionally by Colin at Chervon Audio. The guy really liked the player when he got it back. Being me and on a mission for KISS i decided to try it. Well, i was bowled over by the improvement in terms of involvement with the musicians and the extra detail on offer. Gone was the artificial sound that plagued this player and which i could not entirely eradicate previously.Dr Bunsen Honeydew wrote: ↑Thu Feb 21, 2019 2:27 pm I am highly suspicious of recently designed DACs and their RF performance, and I am sure some NVA amps have been damaged by them. It reminded me of the arseholes at the BBC back in the early 70's suddenly making speaker 10 times more complicated and blaming some of the amps around then for not coping with them - cart before horse - cart before horse !!!!!!!!!
EVERY TIME in music when you complicate things you make them worse musically and more difficult to accommodate - it is ludicrous and all for the sake of finding a bullshit to help YOU part with your money.
I thought about introducing a buffer of some sort between dac chip and passive pre as i was (wrongly) worried about the dac's ability to drive the next stage. I put my unmodified Naim CD3.5 (yes i have a stock player as well for comparisons) in the system and my worries disappeared.There were no problems with the frequency extremes or dynamic ability after all. And the dac chip in the CD3.5 is a cheapie and not that highly thought of. To be quite honest i could not give a toss anymore. I am learning to ignore the bullshit and stick with my simplistic beliefs.
Problem with us audiofools is we are extremely gullible and because something is said to be crap (it must be cos its cheap) then we trust this and move with the flock. Baa. Slapping yourself around the face and chanting "i shall not believe the hype" helps in my experience
DIY FREE ZONE
- Fretless
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Re: Digital Upscaling
Good tip Stu - I'll have to give it a try.
Upstairs:
VinylPro-Ject 1.2 + Grado Sig Jr + Cambridge Alva Duo
DigiVolumio PC + Kiss DP-500 + Sabaj A20d
NVA: Cube2 - SSP - LS6+ Sabaj A10a {x2)
Little Bear MC2 + AQ NightHawk
Downstairs:
VinylLogic DM101 + Syrinx LE1 + Grado Sig MCX
DigiDenafrips Ares II + Volumio PC + Cambridge CXC
NVA: P50 & PSU - BMUAiyima A07 MAX + Arcam One
HP: Allo DigiOne + Sabaj A10d + AQ NightOwl
Office: Allo DigiOne SIG + SMSL M300se + Douk G4 (x2)
Mission 760 + Monolith 887 + German Maestro GMP 450