mains block and equipment cable

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Berty bass
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Re: mains block amd eqipment cable

Unread post by Berty bass » Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:39 am

Dr Bunsen Honeydew wrote:
Fri Dec 29, 2017 2:29 pm
Hard wiring is always better than plugs, if you don't have to change sockets or move things around, and cheap. Any mains block will make things worse, they cannot make things better, filters, trips, fuses, and other bollocks make things worse again. Only two things make things better Balanced Mains and Regenerated Mains, they are different in benefits and both good. Obviously my opinion is the NVA BMU is the best (and cheaper).

Regarding mains supply Radial is much better and safer than a Ring. With Radial you don't need fuses and can avoid the fecking awful UK 13 amp mains plug and use Schuko or even better BS546 15amp.
Doc, I find this intriguing. To a complete numpty like myself can you explain why the above is the case? I find the whole mains thing very confusing but am fascinated by observations of the differences that bad or good mains delivery can have on presentation. The thing about the plugs too.

alfer
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Re: mains block and equipment cable

Unread post by alfer » Wed Jan 03, 2018 9:55 am

Berti and anyone else. Do not think different peoples experiences will be yours if you do what they speak of.
Electricity and environment make a huge difference. I have a home free from all the gadgetry others must have and an electricity supply remarkably free from nastys others complain of. Stable and hardly ever a dip in volts. Attempt to fix what isn’t a problem resulted in wasted effort and expense.

Do you have a mains problem or are you chasing something that might make a significant difference like speaker cables can do.

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karatestu
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Re: mains block amd eqipment cable

Unread post by karatestu » Wed Jan 03, 2018 10:30 am

Berty bass wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:39 am
Dr Bunsen Honeydew wrote:
Fri Dec 29, 2017 2:29 pm
Hard wiring is always better than plugs, if you don't have to change sockets or move things around, and cheap. Any mains block will make things worse, they cannot make things better, filters, trips, fuses, and other bollocks make things worse again. Only two things make things better Balanced Mains and Regenerated Mains, they are different in benefits and both good. Obviously my opinion is the NVA BMU is the best (and cheaper).

Regarding mains supply Radial is much better and safer than a Ring. With Radial you don't need fuses and can avoid the fecking awful UK 13 amp mains plug and use Schuko or even better BS546 15amp.
Doc, I find this intriguing. To a complete numpty like myself can you explain why the above is the case? I find the whole mains thing very confusing but am fascinated by observations of the differences that bad or good mains delivery can have on presentation. The thing about the plugs too.
Getting rid of bad contacts is a good thing (IEC connectors and 13 amp plugs ) and reducing the number of mains connections in the chain to a minimum is good. Hardwiring results in a much better connection e.g mains cable enters component via a cable gland and the live, neutral and earth (if used) go straight to the next component (on/off switch, transformer if no on/off switch) where they are soldered. If classII construction is used then there is no earth wire, if class I is used then the earth wire is connected to the metal case.

Not sure about hardwiring at the other end (wall sockets) - you would need some sort of junction box (instead of plug sockets) which accepts bare wire and clamps the cable so it can not be pulled out accidentally.

15A round pin plugs are seen as better than 13A oblong pin plugs as they make a better contact and have no fuses in them.
Naim, Linn & Harbeth fanboy

Berty bass
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Re: mains block and equipment cable

Unread post by Berty bass » Wed Jan 03, 2018 10:58 am

Alfer - I've no problem as far as I'm aware and I'm not chasing anything. The question is posed in an attempt to address my ignorance of the issues and effects.

Karatestu - thank you. Your reply makes sense to me, especially in the context of Doc's overall approach to his own products - of reducing the number components, to limit the potential to introduce interference between the source and its signal destination. In this case that would be the mains itself and the piece of kit they are powering.

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Dr Bunsen Honeydew
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Re: mains block amd eqipment cable

Unread post by Dr Bunsen Honeydew » Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:25 am

Berty bass wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 8:39 am
Dr Bunsen Honeydew wrote:
Fri Dec 29, 2017 2:29 pm
Hard wiring is always better than plugs, if you don't have to change sockets or move things around, and cheap. Any mains block will make things worse, they cannot make things better, filters, trips, fuses, and other bollocks make things worse again. Only two things make things better Balanced Mains and Regenerated Mains, they are different in benefits and both good. Obviously my opinion is the NVA BMU is the best (and cheaper).

Regarding mains supply Radial is much better and safer than a Ring. With Radial you don't need fuses and can avoid the fecking awful UK 13 amp mains plug and use Schuko or even better BS546 15amp.
Doc, I find this intriguing. To a complete numpty like myself can you explain why the above is the case? I find the whole mains thing very confusing but am fascinated by observations of the differences that bad or good mains delivery can have on presentation. The thing about the plugs too.
I could but it would take up a long time to do it again - it is all in the archive, the subject has been fully discussed and explained.

Berty bass
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Re: mains block and equipment cable

Unread post by Berty bass » Wed Jan 03, 2018 11:37 am

Fair enough, Doc. I'll have a search and hopefully end up less ignorant after the appropriate reading. :)

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Classicrock
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Re: mains block and equipment cable

Unread post by Classicrock » Wed Jan 03, 2018 12:59 pm

Something worth noting concerning ring mains. All depends what you plug into them - too much stuff permanently plugged in (non hi-fi). I believe if you don't overload and properly installed OK. It appears it is mostly badly made fridges and tumble driers that cause fires. Grenfell Tower not caused by cladding but a fridge. Logic is they should be panicking more about fridges. Obviously a dedicated radial will aid Hi-fi sound if it is practical and all those fuses can't help. I use the cheapest cheapo mains blocks which have no fuse and neon light.

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Quarknosis
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Re: mains block and equipment cable

Unread post by Quarknosis » Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:14 pm

I wonder how many cables can be wired into a standard plug? Obviously it depends on the size of the cable but if it could be done it would take the extension block out of the equation and reduce the amount of connections needed.

I have used one of those 4 way plugs in the past but can't say that I noticed any difference at the time.
NVA AP70sa - LS6 - Doc Mod JPW P1 - Lenco/Jelco/Denon DL110 - Cocktail Audio X30 > Rega DAC. TIS & SSC

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Classicrock
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Re: mains block and equipment cable

Unread post by Classicrock » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:00 pm

Quarknosis wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 1:14 pm
I wonder how many cables can be wired into a standard plug? Obviously it depends on the size of the cable but if it could be done it would take the extension block out of the equation and reduce the amount of connections needed.

I have used one of those 4 way plugs in the past but can't say that I noticed any difference at the time.
Max load is 13 amps so that would rule out power amps. Those multi wire plugs may now be illegal a I don't see them any more. Little gain in practice I would think. As Doc suggests use round pin or schuko plugs into adaptor. Then 13 amp to ring main or schuko into dedicated radial.

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Dr Bunsen Honeydew
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Re: mains block and equipment cable

Unread post by Dr Bunsen Honeydew » Wed Jan 03, 2018 4:51 pm

Classicrock wrote:
Wed Jan 03, 2018 12:59 pm
Something worth noting concerning ring mains. All depends what you plug into them - too much stuff permanently plugged in (non hi-fi). I believe if you don't overload and properly installed OK. It appears it is mostly badly made fridges and tumble driers that cause fires. Grenfell Tower not caused by cladding but a fridge. Logic is they should be panicking more about fridges. Obviously a dedicated radial will aid Hi-fi sound if it is practical and all those fuses can't help. I use the cheapest cheapo mains blocks which have no fuse and neon light.
The problem with a ring is they do not fail safe, if a wire is loose or disconnected it still works but the cable one way in the ring is being overloaded and can flame.

Go to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ring_circuit and read criticism.

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