Devon DL-160 with Phono1

[tomblackford]

Hi,

Still really enjoying my Phono1, even with my bottom-of-the-line Project Debug III and OMB10 cart. It's really is a much 'beefier' sound than my previous phono stage / preamp combo, but now I've got the upgrade bug I'm in the mood to upgrade the deck.

I might be able to lay my hands on a TT armed with a Denon DL-160, which is a 'high output moving coil' cart, which supposedly can be used without an MC pre-amp, but I notice the output voltage is only around 1.7mV (see [1]) whereas my OMB is 4mV (see [2]).

Would you recommend any tweaks to the Phono1 (perhaps to increase the gain) to match to this new cart? As you might remember, I'm using a passive pre, so I think a good output level is advantageous.

Thanks in advance,

tom

[1] http://www.needledoctor.com/Denon-DL-160-Cartridge
[2] http://www.turntableneedles.com/Ortofon ... _2999.html

[Dr Bunsen Honeydew]

Suck and see, if the volume level needed is achievable in the swing of the pot then nothing needs changing. It matters not if the control need to be set higher, it doesn't effect musical quality, it is only to do with signal voltage. Because volume controls are normally the only thing we touch people get a delusionary concern about them, and think they have to be set at a certain point for them, it is nonsense I am afraid.

[_D_S_J_R_]

The 160 is long discontinued, so bear that in mind when negotiating a price. What deck?

No issues at all with the Phono 1. The Denon 110 and 160 have slightly lower output than the OM10 I remember, but that shouldn't be an issue at all. if you want a little more gain, this could be done, but it's honestly unnecessary. I remember from the last batch, the Phono 1 is incredibly quiet on MM setting, so noise will never be an issue.

[tomblackford]

Wow - as always, thanks for the quick response guys. Yes the Phono1 really is very quiet.

The deck is a TD-150 with a SME 3009 (including fluid damper)... I believe the DL-160 is only about 18months old with v light use. I was thinking it would make an interesting contrast to the Project...

[Dr Bunsen Honeydew]

Not my taste of deck but loads like them, if it is a good price go for it, I am sure it will be better than the Project.

[tomblackford]

Thanks Richard.

I did seriously look at the Pioneer DD decks, as you suggested as they looked great and are clearly highly regarded. Sadly they were all too deep to fit the child-safe location I have for a TT. In terms of DD decks, I think a Luxman PD-264 might fit but I wasn't certain that would be quite so much of an improvement or a particularly good platform for future upgrading.

Obviously there was also LP-12s at the same size as the TD-150 but then we're into bigger money...

[jammy395]

Go for it Tom.........Look forward to yer findings.

On a note of Phono silence.....Ive had many phonos (stand alone & built in) over the years.......All imparted some noise.
I loved my Soneteer Sedley.......but even that was eclipsed on the noise (lack of ) front by the NVA phono1.....
....Ive a phono 2 with extra PSUs now and that does kick ass....

Edit.....Its so quiet I can only play Heavy Metal at Vol 11...........

[_D_S_J_R_]

If the SME is an 'improved' model, it's a bit too light and resonant for this cartridge, but the black tac that SME put in between the cartridge and shell proper should help. The damper should have the thinnest paddle and baby oil instead of the goo that was supplied originally - who needs a cueing device with the damper when you can hold the stylus above the record and just let go......... The non-'improved' SME merely needs a Sumiko or similar headshell for modern and moving coil cartridges imo.

As for the deck, I can give you chapter and verse on setting the thing up to give you a half decent sound quality. A new belt regularly/annually is a must and I'd look at a cork mat (the samples for a tenner are fine and one or two vendors do a 'Thorens-cut' one so you don't need to remove the 45 adaptor). The 150 mat with multiple broken concentric rings on isn't bad though, but avoid the 160/125mk2 mats as they're awful! As the chassis is basically the same size as an LP12 (the two decks are so alike it's spooky if you take the bullshit away ) a second hand Linn plinth makes an excellent upgrade and the chassis sits in the cut-out very well, the only thing being the arm-board width difference

[tomblackford]

Thanks again to you all for all the tips. I just spotted my typo in the thread title - rest assured it's a Denon DL-160, not the lesser spotted Devon DL-160 (targeted at the then-lucrative West Country market, with extra creamy sound).

Yes - it is an SME s2 'improved' as far as I can see, with a fixed headshell, which I believe might reduced the weight further (relative to the detachable headshells).

I think the deck looks like a MK1 (I think) and is a single-owner deck which cost the owner £40 new back in late 60s (which I reckon equates to around £800-1000 in todays money). SME / fluid damper was professionally fitted a few years later (costing more than the original deck) and he still has some of the original boxes. I have a feeling it has been pretty well cared-for.

I'd heard mention about the Linn plinth upgrade... it's really nice to know there are upgrades like that available should I want to tinker. Is there also a common upgrade by replacing the base of the standard plinth?

Also thanks for all the tips with the fluid damper. Getting all this goodness set up correctly feels like it might be a little bit of a challenge but hopefully things won't go to awry in transit (I'm collecting by car)... I collect at the weekend, so I may yet be back on here asking questions (will start a new topic outside of the NVA room)...

Thanks again!

[Daniel Quinn]

£40 in 1967 is now £665.67