Fane 12-250TC Full Range Speaker

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SteveTheShadow
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Re: Fane 12-250TC Full Range Speaker

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Dr Bunsen Honeydew wrote: Wed Jul 18, 2018 8:18 pm If I had the time I would do a pair with another 12 incher on the top, cos' I am a semi omni junkie, though these nearly cleared that hurdle for me at Owston.

I presume being a pro company they do a 16 ohm version.
I think you have to request them.
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SteveTheShadow
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Re: Fane 12-250TC Full Range Speaker

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montechristo358 wrote: Wed Jul 18, 2018 8:27 pm are they happy with zero toe in?
Yep,
They have a rising response on axis. Firing them straight down the room keeps you off axis and flattens the rise perfectly.
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Latteman
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Re: Fane 12-250TC Full Range Speaker

Unread post by Latteman »

Another amazing build
Analogue Source -
Denon DP47f- Ortofon mc20 supreme
Ifi Zen Phono
Doug Self balanced Pre amp
Akai 4000DS mk2 R2R
Digital Sources- IfI stream, Ifi Neo idsd Dac; Tidal / Radio Paradise
Amplification Nva 30vdc mono blocks
Speakers Lii Audio F-15 in Open Baffle; Ls6
Weiduka AC8.8- for digital sources
Mini BMU for analog sources

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SteveTheShadow
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Re: Fane 12-250TC Full Range Speaker

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Have been having a bit of creative fun with these speakers over the last couple of days, but first a bit of background:
For my 61st birthday back in January, my daughter bought me a tube amp book. She thought I'd already got plenty of tube amp books about hi-fi audio stuff, so she got me a very interesting book on guitar amps by Dave Hunter, entitled "The Guitar Amp Handbook - Understanding Tube Amplifiers and Getting Great Sounds"

The book is full of sensible stuff, that can be applied to hi-fi amps as well as guitar amps. If we forget the sections on tone stacks, which are nevertheless very interesting, there is a ton of stuff on how to set about voicing an amplifier, that I knew little or nothing of. BS free sections on coupling capacitors, which take the piss out of the expensive audio signal coupling capacitors and stupidly priced resistors that the DIY tube amp builder can't seem to escape from. A great book I thought.

It was the section on output attenuators that piqued my interest. These enable the guitarist to obtain a cranked up, flat out tone in a studio environment without deafening themselves in the process. These attenuators go in the speaker circuit of a guitar amp and are normally comprised of a network of high powered resistors in series with the speaker line. If you know anything about speaker design, you'll realise straight away that such a network is neither use nor ornament for a domestic hi-fi speaker. BUT one particular attenuator, the Weber "VST MASS" output attenuator made me sit up and pay attention. The MASS uses a magnet/coil speaker motor as the series element rather than a big resistor, meaning that the attenuator provides a proper reactive load that mirrors the way a speaker works with an amplifier output stage in a way that a simple resistor does not.

Now I'm currently in the process of building a single valve output transformerless amplifier using the 13E1 radar power regulator and LW transmitting tube and although the breadboard I built, will drive an 8 Ohm speaker, OTLs work far better into a higher impedance load and 8 Ohms is considered marginal. 4 Ohms is right out, 16 Ohms and we're getting somewhere.

Left over from my omni experiments I have a couple of 8 Ohm Faital Pro 6inch drivers, one of which I put the cone through with a screwdriver. I wanted a way to make my Fane speakers a 16 Ohm load without having to carry out irreversible mods to the fabric of the cabinet and adding a driver. There are no 16 Ohm Fane 12-250-TC drivers nor any plans to make any, so series connecting two 8 Ohm drivers is for now, the only way of getting to 16 Ohms. I decided therefore a couple of days ago to do a jury rig of twin drivers to make a 16 Ohm speaker.

Inside both of my Fane cabinets, there is a horizontal stiffening brace below the main driver cutout. This brace has a number of four inch holes in it that maintain the cab volume whilst providing stiffening to the side and back walls. I figured that an extra internal driver could be fastened over one of the holes in the stiffening brace and wired in series with the main driver, to provide a 16 Ohm load without any visible evidence on the outside of the cabinets, so yesterday I spent a couple of useful hours fitting a scrapped Faital Pro 6" driver inside each cab. The DC resistance of each speaker system is now 13.5 Ohms, so a nominal AC impedance of 15 Ohms is not beyond the bounds of reason. What effectively we now have, because of the other holes in the brace, is a small, up/down firing open baffle speaker operating inside a sealed box speaker :shock: I mean, how fecking stupid can you get! :grin:

Connected up to my A20/P20 amp, with LS5 speaker cable, the result is hilariously good! The volume is of course slightly lower for the same setting, but when that is corrected I'm well pleased with the sound. Interestingly, the on-axis, tipped up response of the main Fane full range driver is no longer evident, which initially seemed curious, but it's explainable; at least I think I can explain it.

There is a bit more ease and liquidity to midrange instrumentation and electric guitars in particular sound spot-on (no surprise there then) loads of harmonics revealed within the distortion envelopes. Vocals come over with natural tones and free of residual shoutiness. Bass instruments can be followed more easily with acoustic bass twang and buzz more obvious; demonstrated to good effect by Ray Brown's playing on Oscar Peterson's "We Get Requests"

The configuration shows great potential and I've one or two ideas on how I can refine the concept.
Allright, yes I know that the obvious answer is identical drivers, series wired in an isobaric arrangement, but that'll mean building new cabs, so for now this'll do me.
For now, it's amazing what a guitar amp handbook and a bit of lateral thinking creativity can get you.
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Latteman
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Re: Fane 12-250TC Full Range Speaker

Unread post by Latteman »

I read the initial post with interest and this adds even more- any chance you took a pic of the additional drivers in situ cheers
Analogue Source -
Denon DP47f- Ortofon mc20 supreme
Ifi Zen Phono
Doug Self balanced Pre amp
Akai 4000DS mk2 R2R
Digital Sources- IfI stream, Ifi Neo idsd Dac; Tidal / Radio Paradise
Amplification Nva 30vdc mono blocks
Speakers Lii Audio F-15 in Open Baffle; Ls6
Weiduka AC8.8- for digital sources
Mini BMU for analog sources

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SteveTheShadow
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Re: Fane 12-250TC Full Range Speaker

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Latteman wrote: Tue Feb 26, 2019 4:12 pm I read the initial post with interest and this adds even more- any chance you took a pic of the additional drivers in situ cheers
I didn't take any pics. Sorry.
Somebody’s telling me the latest scandals.
Somebody’s stepping on my plastic sandals. Joe Jackson (1979)

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SteveTheShadow
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Re: Fane 12-250TC Full Range Speaker

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Latteman wrote: Tue Feb 26, 2019 4:12 pm I read the initial post with interest and this adds even more- any chance you took a pic of the additional drivers in situ cheers
Right! I have some pics now.
So because these 6" drivers were effectively scrap, due to torn/pierced cones, I decided to go the whole hog and use them as just the speaker motors, as they are used in the Weber MASS guitar amp output attenuator.
Image

Here, they're mounted inside the cabinet, screwed to the holey brace.
Image

So now they are no longer a speaker within a speaker, simply a means to make a 16 Ohm system for my under construction, OTL amp. A nice sounding piece of kit with a solid state amp too
Last edited by SteveTheShadow on Thu Feb 28, 2019 8:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Dr Bunsen Honeydew
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Re: Fane 12-250TC Full Range Speaker

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Wool wadding :naughty:

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SteveTheShadow
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Re: Fane 12-250TC Full Range Speaker

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Dr Bunsen Honeydew wrote: Thu Feb 28, 2019 8:31 pm Wool wadding :naughty:
I know, I know. :)
I've plans before OWSTON, as you suggested at the venue last year, to line them with ceramic tiles. I've just been occupied with doing the house up.
Last edited by SteveTheShadow on Thu Feb 28, 2019 8:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Fane 12-250TC Full Range Speaker

Unread post by Dr Bunsen Honeydew »

Series wiring is always musically better I have been saying this for years (decades), ask DQ. Trouble is in a dem situation a series wired speaker is quieter, needs more on the VC so ignorant people think it must be worse.

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